Discussion of chapter 83

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Discussion of chapter 83

Post by imksoon on Mon 3 Oct 2011 - 22:35

I



read chapter 83 on the internet and it was so sad ......

anyway, Jose tells henrietta "if you meant it, I want you to fulfill your promise."

and Henrietta says "Yes Signore" then A shell of 5.7mm shown very next cut.

it means Jose shoot henrietta...

but in Elsa's case Elsa shoot her 'charger' and suicide.(Am I right? in Korean version, we call Jose, Jean,Hirshire kind of people 'Charger')

Then, why did Jose shoot Henrietta with his hand? I think if he want to fulfill her promise,

Henrietta should shoot Jose one more time and suicide by herself... but why Jose killed

Henrietta? And how did Henrietta realized that Jose will not love her at all?



so Many curiosities to me... wanna know you guys' opinion of it...

Ah... depressed...

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Re: Discussion of chapter 83

Post by Kiskaloo on Mon 3 Oct 2011 - 22:44

I originally thought Henrietta shot Jose and then herself, but it may be that each taking the other's life is more...poetic...

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Re: Discussion of chapter 83

Post by Professor Voodoo on Mon 3 Oct 2011 - 23:08

imksoon wrote:Then, why did Jose shoot Henrietta with his hand? I think if he want to fulfill her promise,

Henrietta should shoot Jose one more time and suicide by herself... but why Jose killed

Henrietta? And how did Henrietta realized that Jose will not love her at all?
I do not think it is an unhappy death for Henrietta at all.

Giuseppe knew that if he died and Henrietta lived on she would do so unhappily...suffering a void in his absence & guilt at having shot him. At worst she could have a breakdown and be a danger to the whole Agency. It was his responsibility to see that 'Etta died along with him.

From Henrietta's perspective, Giuse was saying "We're together now; there's no reason for either of us to continue living because things are perfect as long as I'm with you...let's remain together forever." In my opinion this was the happiest moment of Henrietta's life.

Giuse's decision ensured that his fratello's death was the opposite of Elsa-Lauro. Elsa died knowing she would never be loved...Henrietta died knowing she was loved.

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Re: Discussion of chapter 83

Post by Triela on Mon 3 Oct 2011 - 23:18

From my pov Jose was being selfish. Wether he shot her or not, wether out of love or whatever, I don't care. I still hate him. I'm disgraced to think I loved him at one time.


Last edited by Triela on Mon 3 Oct 2011 - 23:48; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Discussion of chapter 83

Post by imksoon on Mon 3 Oct 2011 - 23:46

[quote="Professor Voodoo"]
imksoon wrote:Giuse's decision ensured that his fratello's death was the opposite of Elsa-Lauro. Elsa died knowing she would never be loved...Henrietta died knowing she was loved.



True, I thought kind of that before and I couldnt end up with happiness ... but

after reading your opinion , it makes me think more brightly ^_^

Thank you for that.

And I think, I just cant forget the warm and happy days of Henrietta Fratello ...

Today I saw GSG season 2 ... and at the end of season2 , Henrietta and Giuse hold their

hands... it makes me so sad... I feel something heavy on my heart now...

Ah... I wish , I didnt see the GSG in my life... it is so sad and depressed T_T



Moreover, GSG season1 ost 'Chiesa' running in my head when I think that scene...

TOO SAD T_T
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Re: Discussion of chapter 83

Post by theprodigalson on Tue 4 Oct 2011 - 0:30

Say what you want, but Etta's smiling in that last scene.

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Re: Discussion of chapter 83

Post by Officer_Charon on Tue 4 Oct 2011 - 1:39

Thank you, Voodoo, that was EXACTLY what was in my head, but I couldn't figure out how to get it into words. Appreciate it!

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Re: Discussion of chapter 83

Post by tremec6speed on Tue 4 Oct 2011 - 2:16

Triela wrote:From my pov Jose was being selfish. Wether he shot her or not, wether out of love or whatever, I don't care. I still hate him. I'm disgraced to think I loved him at one time.
On a gut level my thoughts exactly, (uh, minus the 'I loved him' part, you know, lolz sweat ) trying to get in Jose's mind however, I figure a bit differently.
He might have thought that with his dying, letting Henrietta live alone would be to her, a fate worse than death. (The Professor's point more or less) The human child had already died to the world and what was left was a perverted version of the little girl who once had been part of a family.
This way, the 'brother' could return her to her true kin at last.
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Re: Discussion of chapter 83

Post by Alfisti on Tue 4 Oct 2011 - 6:07

theprodigalson wrote:Say what you want, but Etta's smiling in that last scene.
I'll be honest: I've always considered 'Etta as having one or two 'roos loose in the top paddock, and it only got worse toward the end. That's probably echoed somewhat in Monty's opinion of the girl.

At the end of the day though, my own thoughts probably reflect those of Tremec and Triela somewhat, though I'd stop short of dispising Jose for his actions as I think they are also very human. Towards the end (at least untill Venice) I think Jose was getting pretty fed up with the whole SWA gamit, unlike his brother he never struck me as having the long term drive. It would be all to easy for him to pass off any feelings of resentment towards the organization which is keeping him tied to the past off onto his needy cyborg. The more cynical side of my mind sees his shooting (and I do think he pulled the trigger) of Henrietta as perhaps one last vindictive act, whether at the girl herself or indirectly at the Agency through her.

Or maybe I just have a particularly jaded view of the world...

What makes me doubt that view of course is Jose's obvious torment at having Henrietta "reset" as it were... though even after that I wonder if he didn't feel somewhat like Marco after Angie suffered her breakdown.

*shrugs* food for thought anyway.

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Re: Discussion of chapter 83

Post by razschi on Tue 4 Oct 2011 - 8:37

There is one thing that bugs me... what if Jose just wants to be with his sister again, where does Henrietta fit into this? Does he still love his sister or Henrietta? I'm confused... Puzzled
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Re: Discussion of chapter 83

Post by Kiskaloo on Tue 4 Oct 2011 - 9:00

razschi wrote:There is one thing that bugs me... what if Jose just wants to be with his sister again, where does Henrietta fit into this? Does he still love his sister or Henrietta? I'm confused... Puzzled

I'm of the opinion he sees Henrietta as a surrogate for Enrica. They looked very much alike when young (and Enrica wore her hair cut short).

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Re: Discussion of chapter 83

Post by imksoon on Wed 5 Oct 2011 - 10:03





I finally accept and understand the death of Henrietta and Giuseppe.

Henrietta had beautiful and romantic relationship with Giuseppe before.

It was tragic to readers who pay attention to them. But once and for all, You are right Professor VooDoo... it was good for Etta that she died with beloved man Giuseppe.

Henrietta will stay forever with Giuseppe...


Last edited by imksoon on Wed 5 Oct 2011 - 18:31; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Discussion of chapter 83

Post by Entropy on Wed 5 Oct 2011 - 17:33

I thought their death was fitting. Giose's story was ultimately about atonement- he never truly cared for revenge the same way Gion did. He felt like he never spent enough time with Enrica and he blamed himself partially for being unable to protect her. He chose Henrietta because he felt like he could save her; to fix a broken girl. It turns out that Henrietta's trauma carried itself into her new life, as well, though, and she had some kind of extreme form of abandonment and attachment issues.

He never felt like he properly atoned for Enrica's murder, and like Gion his mind was filled with revenge. In classic tragic fashion, however, he finally realizes the truth right before the end. He never had to atone, nor did he really have to pick revenge like Gion. Henrietta's fate was sealed, were she to commit suicide, live life a pitiable, traumatized girl, or die as a cyborg, she was never going to live a normal life.

Their story is one of the highest tragedy, much like Orion and Artemis, one man's grief and one girl's trauma. Perhaps they did find purpose and meaning in each other, but neither would ever be what the other one wanted. Giose could never be Henrietta's lover, and Henrietta could never be Enrica.

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Re: Discussion of chapter 83

Post by crazyidiot78 on Wed 5 Oct 2011 - 18:52

I'm with you on this one Entropy. A sad but moving story line.
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