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Re: Petrushka

Post by Three Dog on Tue 8 May 2012 - 2:26

@Thescarredman wrote:Elsa's theme has to be 'Mad World.'
Either that or In The End [Album Version] by Lincon Park.
@tremec6speed wrote: Lauro's could be The Unforgiven by Metallica
Nice . I wanted someone to have a Metallica song, but couldn't figure out who.

For Claes I was thinking either On The Road Again by Canned Heat or Copperhead Road by Steve Earl. Not so much for the lyrics, but for the rythem. Lyrics wise, I'd go with Eye of the Tiger, by Surivor.

Henrietta would have I Can't Smile Without You by Barry Manilow, 'cause of the stalker level affection she has for Jose.

And for laughs Angelica should have Purple People Eater by Sheb Wooley. There isn't any other reason than that I think it would be funny .

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Tross on Wed 9 May 2012 - 3:48

[quote="Destroyer of Worlds ;D"]
@Tross wrote:
Can you say 'thread derailment'? Razz

Whoops, my bad again. Not that anyone seems to mind though. Smile I have a brilliant idea though. This would be a perfect thread for the music section! Plus, this thread could go back to being about Petra, so really, it'd be a win-win. cheers

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Three Dog on Wed 9 May 2012 - 4:05

[quote="Tross"]
Destroyer of Worlds ;D wrote:
@Tross wrote:
Can you say 'thread derailment'? Razz

Whoops, my bad again. Not that anyone seems to mind though. Smile I have a brilliant idea though. This would be a perfect thread for the music section! Plus, this thread could go back to being about Petra, so really, it'd be a win-win. cheers
There's a music section ?!
Oh my God, this is so fucking awsome! My mind just went .
Bu who'd start the thread? You led to the derailment, so I think you should have the honour.

Also seriously, I don't think anyone here minds derailment. My favorite example is on one thread which was 'why deosn't Rico wear dresses' and it somehow turned into a discuaion as to why henrietta doesn't have a uterus (I don't think I spelt it right, but I'm on my parents computer, so I hope you understand why I'm not checking ).

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Thescarredman on Wed 9 May 2012 - 16:59

Back to Petra, sort of. Is anybody going to do a Petra/Sandro piece for the new collab story?


Last edited by Thescarredman on Wed 9 May 2012 - 17:01; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : correct cruddy spelling)

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Tross on Wed 9 May 2012 - 19:33

Destroyer of Worlds ;D wrote:
There's a music section ?!
Oh my God, this is so fucking awsome! My mind just went .
Bu who'd start the thread? You led to the derailment, so I think you should have the honour.

And it's an honor I gladly accept. Though, I don't feel like chronicling every song that has been mentioned so far and I think it'd be best if we start over again anyways. I will put in a nod to this thread derailment, so if anyone wants to see what we've posted so far, they can come to the Petra thread. Besides, everyone's different, so I'm sure they have different ideas for theme songs for the characters. If we make a topic for it, there's no "only one universally accepted theme song per character" rule. The threads with the least amount of rules tend to make for more relaxed discussion anyways.

Destroyer of Worlds ;D wrote:Also seriously, I don't think anyone here minds derailment. My favorite example is on one thread which was 'why deosn't Rico wear dresses' and it somehow turned into a discuaion as to why henrietta doesn't have a uterus (I don't think I spelt it right, but I'm on my parents computer, so I hope you understand why I'm not checking ).

And that's one of the things I like best about this community. cheers The majority of forums I go to don't have "no thread derailment" as one of the written rules. study It's more of a norm than a regulation. I'm a sociology major so if I ever use any of these terms, and anyone is confused by them, feel free to let me know. While people derail threads all the time, regardless of the forum, and it happens to even the best of us, mods tend to nudge the discussion back on track, and don't encourage making a habit of it. As a norm, it's more enforced by the other users. It's little things like this and bumping threads, among other things that are negatively sanctioned by most communities, and it usually isn't considered an ideal type of behavior. I'm glad this forum is a lot more relaxed about that sort of thing. Oh, right, that thread. I'll go make that then. See Thescarredman's post for more on topic discussion.

Edit: The thread has been created. Check it out in the music section.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Nachtsider on Wed 9 May 2012 - 22:51

@Tross wrote:And that's one of the things I like best about this community. cheers The majority of forums I go to don't have "no thread derailment" as one of the written rules. study It's more of a norm than a regulation. I'm a sociology major so if I ever use any of these terms, and anyone is confused by them, feel free to let me know. While people derail threads all the time, regardless of the forum, and it happens to even the best of us, mods tend to nudge the discussion back on track, and don't encourage making a habit of it. As a norm, it's more enforced by the other users. It's little things like this and bumping threads, among other things that are negatively sanctioned by most communities, and it usually isn't considered an ideal type of behavior. I'm glad this forum is a lot more relaxed about that sort of thing.
Norms can go to hell, and so can those other forums. Very Happy

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Alfisti on Thu 10 May 2012 - 6:38

@Thescarredman wrote:Back to Petra, sort of. Is anybody going to do a Petra/Sandro piece for the new collab story?
I'm running straight OC at the moment, so not here. Think at the moment you may have free reign on that one.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Tross on Fri 11 May 2012 - 1:41

@Nachtsider wrote:
Norms can go to hell, and so can those other forums. Very Happy

Well, to be fair this forum has its norms too, but it does challenge the general perception of certain things, which I think is great. Oh, right, Petra. Well, she is the only red-headed cyborg as far as I know(as of chapter 58). Then again, it is kind of hard to tell hair colour in black and white manga. Maybe one of those other girls has red hair. Puzzled I think one of them does, actually. But she is the first cannon cyborg with red hair. Though, come to think of it, there are background characters. study But she's the first important cannon cyborg with red hair. cheers I'm not sure where I'm going with this, but red-headed cyborgs FTW!


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Re: Petrushka

Post by Three Dog on Fri 11 May 2012 - 1:53

@Tross wrote:
@Nachtsider wrote:
Norms can go to hell, and so can those other forums. Very Happy

Well, to be fair this forum has its norms too, but it does challenge the general perception of certain things, which I think is great. Oh, right, Petra. Well, she is the only red-headed cyborg as far as I know(as of chapter 58). Then again, it is kind of hard to tell hair colour in black and white manga. Maybe one of those other girls has red hair. Puzzled I think one of them does, actually. But she is the first cannon cyborg with red hair. Though, come to think of it, there are background characters. study But she's the first important cannon cyborg with red hair. :cheers:I'm not sure where I'm going with this, but red-headed cyborgs FTW!

Three cheers for gingers!Razz

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Nachtsider on Fri 11 May 2012 - 2:57

Some might argue that Henrietta's a redhead, too.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Three Dog on Fri 11 May 2012 - 6:58

@Nachtsider wrote:Some might argue that Henrietta's a redhead, too.
I'd thought that initially, but then everyone here started calling her a brunette, so I started doing that in my fics to stop as much confusion as possible, and then I just accepted that she's brunette.
Personally, I prefer her as a ginger than a brunette, 'cause then we can make jokes about her having no soul.

Beatrice could be another ginger, since they aren't meant to stand out and, well... puple hair is a little uncommon and unusual and aberrant and strange and odd and standoutish and...

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Thescarredman on Fri 11 May 2012 - 16:38

Just on the basis of the freckles, might Fleccia be a redhead too?

And, by the way... The Gen 2's seem to have their own dorm, or floor, or wing, or whatever, separate from the Gen 1's ( sensible, you wouldn't want the 1's to bully them, after all ). The rooms seem bigger, and not so little-girlish. But the Gen 2 girls still share rooms. Question: who is Petra's room mate? The first time we see Petra in her room, she's doing her morning stretches in the bed farthest from the door, and Fleccia's kicking back on the other, as Soli appears at the open door. The next time, when Sandro's being informed about his girl's cancer, Soli's sitting up in that bed. Any clues?
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Nachtsider on Fri 11 May 2012 - 17:59

@Thescarredman wrote:And, by the way... The Gen 2's seem to have their own dorm, or floor, or wing, or whatever, separate from the Gen 1's ( sensible, you wouldn't want the 1's to bully them, after all ).
Dude... you serious? If anything, it's more likely to be the other way around, with the Gen 2s doing the bullying. Whoever heard of an eleven-year-old smacking a sixteen-year-old around?

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Thescarredman on Fri 11 May 2012 - 21:29

Review the time Petra tried on Claes's glasses. Whoever heard of an eleven-year-old being able to knock a sixteen-year-old through a brick wall? The Gen 1's are less emotionally stable, too, because of their heavier conditioning.
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Thescarredman on Fri 11 May 2012 - 21:36

[quote="Destroyer of Worlds ;DBeatrice could be another ginger, since they aren't meant to stand out and, well... puple hair is a little uncommon and unusual and aberrant and strange and odd and standoutish and...[/quote]

Not in Japan. Anybody who watches anime knows that Japanese girls have hair and eyes in every color of the rainbow.
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Re: Petrushka

Post by crazyidiot78 on Fri 11 May 2012 - 21:43

Some how I don't see the generation 2 girls trying to bully the generation 1 girls after Claes's little explosion on Petra not to mention what would happen if they pissed off Triela on a red letter day.
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Thescarredman on Fri 11 May 2012 - 21:56

The two 'classes' don't hang out together much either, I think; when Angie died, none of the 'older' girls even knew her name.
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Three Dog on Sat 12 May 2012 - 0:22

@Thescarredman wrote:
Destroyer of Worlds ;D wrote:Beatrice could be another ginger, since they aren't meant to stand out and, well... puple hair is a little uncommon and unusual and aberrant and strange and odd and standoutish and...

Not in Japan. Anybody who watches anime knows that Japanese girls have hair and eyes in every color of the rainbow.
(You forgot the "] at the end of my name on the quote, just thought you should know)

If we're taking anime as fact, then over half the women in Japan are lesbians, not to mention they are all magic, super strong, have redicualously huge breasts, are in the future and fly around in mechas. And have American accents when they speak english. Additoinally, no ones skirt goes higher lower than the top of thier thigh.

And us, the male population, are useless in every sence of the word, save for a lucky handful.

Lets face it, the only reason women still keep us around is to open jars, if they can do it themselves, we're fucked!

Also, for any other anime, I probably wouldn't argue about hair colour, but GsG is more realistic than most so I think purple hair is... silly, to be polite. Actually, that was a lie, I love to bitch about the un-realistic things in everything.

@crazyidiot78 wrote:Some how I don't see the generation 2 girls trying
to bully the generation 1 girls after Claes's little explosion on Petra
not to mention what would happen if they pissed off Triela on a red
letter day.
@Thescarredman wrote:The two 'classes' don't hang out together much
either, I think; when Angie died, none of the 'older' girls even knew
her name.
I think it might be moe of a psycological thing that they don't hang out rather than to stop them being at each others throats (which could be quite entertaining). More often than not, people look to be with people that are like them, like the new kids at school will hang out with other new kids at school, untill they've slowly tested the waters with the other groups and gotten to know them through obsevations in class and stuff like that. You have to remember that the second Gens haven't been there long, so they haven't had much time to test the waters.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Tross on Sat 12 May 2012 - 14:26

I think it's pretty obvious why the Gen 2s don't hang out with the Gen 1s. How often do 16 year olds hang out with 11 year olds? They tend to hang out with their own age group, give or take(as in, it's not unusual for a 16 year old to hang out with a 15 or 17 year old). The only reason Petra knows the Gen 1s better than the rest of them, is that she was the first Gen 2 cyborg, and those other girls weren't around when she first came to the agency, so Gen 1s were the only other cyborgs she could interact with. None of the others had any reason to interact with them, so I'm pretty sure that's all it is.
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Thescarredman on Sat 12 May 2012 - 17:08

I'd tend to agree, Tross. But I still think it's prudent not to house them in the same wing.
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Tross on Sun 13 May 2012 - 0:48

I suppose so. I'm sure the SWA has its reasons for the housing being the way it is. It's probably just a matter of putting the Cyborgs where there's room. Petra's room for example, used to be a spare room where Claes kept her paintings. An anti-terrorism agency is probably a lot more concerned about whether the cyborgs would be effective in countering terrorism than where they're housed. Keep in mind that European buildings tend to be old, and while each country has its own rules, there tends to be limits on what kind of modifications can be made to them, and how many. It is a large building, and finding an empty room to use as a bedroom shouldn't be too difficult, and it's unlikely that a room would have to be modified to suit that purpose. But, when you have to factor in adequate washroom and shower facilities that are up to modern standards, among other things, and wanting the dorms to be in reasonable proximity of them, it may not be as simple. I have no idea if Italy allows building expansions.
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Alfisti on Sun 13 May 2012 - 3:40

@Tross wrote: Keep in mind that European buildings tend to be old, and while each country has its own rules, there tends to be limits on what kind of modifications can be made to them, and how many. It is a large building, and finding an empty room to use as a bedroom shouldn't be too difficult, and it's unlikely that a room would have to be modified to suit that purpose. But, when you have to factor in adequate washroom and shower facilities that are up to modern standards, among other things, and wanting the dorms to be in reasonable proximity of them, it may not be as simple. I have no idea if Italy allows building expansions.
My understanding is that Italy's urban planning and cultural heritage/urban conservation guidelines are pretty strict... That's why they're having so much trouble building a subway in Rome. That said, I'm sure a deep-black agency would have its ways to get around those laws if, say, it needed another bathroom.

I tend to agree with Tross in that the girls probably don't mix much as a result of the age gaps. That said, the 2nd Gen rooms did appear to have a more modern layout. Potententially another reason to keep the two generations seperated is that, by the time the 2nd Gens are coming online, the Gen1 girls are starting to degenerate as the conditioning kills them, that'd have to be a bit of a moral killer to know it was coming for you, particularly for the more emotionally normalised (aparently) second generation.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Thescarredman on Sun 13 May 2012 - 5:48

Fleccia certainly seems pragmatic and cynical about it, talking about how efficient the Agency is to bury them within sight of where they're created.
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Thescarredman on Sun 13 May 2012 - 5:49

We do have a talent for drifting off-topic, don't we?
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Three Dog on Sun 13 May 2012 - 6:02

@Thescarredman wrote:We do have a talent for drifting off-topic, don't we?
Talent? Bitch please, we turn it into an art form. I think that may be how this thread has stayed alive longer than the others. Yeah, I just checked, second longest as far as cyborgs are concerned is Triela's, and I'm pretty sure ther isn't one person who doesn't like her.
@Alfisti wrote:...by the time the 2nd Gens are coming online, the Gen1
girls are starting to degenerate as the conditioning kills them, that'd
have to be a bit of a moral killer to know it was coming for you, particularly for the more emotionally normalised (aparently) second generation.
I can see the sense in that. But I can also see the sense in trying to ge the two groups to interact and for the Gen Ones to act as role models for the Gen Twos. I know that what little interaction with the Gen Ones Petra did have influenced her at least a little, perhaps there's some advantage to that.
@Thescarredman wrote:Fleccia certainly seems pragmatic and cynical
about it, talking about how efficient the Agency is to bury them within
sight of where they're created.
Fleccia... Fleccia...? Oh, that's right, Freckles. I think she has a point, the cyborgs are expensive after all, any resuable parts would be extracted from the deceased and the rest kept near-by 'just in case' something comes up and so that no one can go snooping around and uncover the Agency's little secret.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Thescarredman on Sun 13 May 2012 - 11:36

Gack. You've been reading my mind, I think; I've been composing this little ficlet about Marco kneeling at Angelica's crypt, noting how small it is, then reflecting that, after the Agency had disassembled all the cybernetics for salvage, what was left after the crematorium was done would fit in a watch box.

And, truly, I don't think it would take much to bring any of these threads back to life.
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Three Dog on Mon 14 May 2012 - 5:13

@Thescarredman wrote:Gack. You've been reading my mind, I think; I've been composing this little ficlet about Marco kneeling at Angelica's crypt, noting how small it is, then reflecting that, after the Agency had disassembled all the cybernetics for salvage, what was left after the crematorium was done would fit in a watch box.
I won't take full credit for that thought, I recall it being said on another thread (I think?).

@Thescarredman wrote:And, truly, I don't think it would take much to bring any of these threads back to life.
Imma see what I can do for Triela then.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Tross on Tue 15 May 2012 - 3:38

@Alfisti wrote:My understanding is that Italy's urban planning and cultural heritage/urban conservation guidelines are pretty strict... That's why they're having so much trouble building a subway in Rome. That said, I'm sure a deep-black agency would have its ways to get around those laws if, say, it needed another bathroom.

I suppose so. The SWA is a government organization, so it obviously has the permission to do what it wants to do, and a lot of funding. How else would they have managed to acquire a large building on a large plot of land that's removed from everything else? Also, they have some pretty cool science labs, which would have required some serious building modifications. I guess by comparison, wanting to add in another bathroom isn't such a big deal, so you do have a point there.

@Alfisti wrote:I tend to agree with Tross in that the girls probably don't mix much as a result of the age gaps. That said, the 2nd Gen rooms did appear to have a more modern layout.


I noticed that. I'm sure a part of it is that bunk beds are more suited to children, so of course they'll have actual beds. But, that only accounts for a part of the layout. I don't think I have a response for that one, so bravo for stumping me. Puzzled

@Alfisti wrote:Potententially another reason to keep the two generations seperated is that, by the time the 2nd Gens are coming online, the Gen1 girls are starting to degenerate as the conditioning kills them, that'd have to be a bit of a moral killer to know it was coming for you, particularly for the more emotionally normalised (aparently) second generation.

That is true. I mean, sure Gen 2s are more emotionally stable, both due to their relatively recent induction into the cyborg program, and less exposure to the unavoidable side effects, as well as to their age. But being constantly reminded that you're going to die within a few years is something that could have a psychological impact. Since all the Gen 1s are all slowly reaching the end, there's very little that could make things any worse for them. Gen 2s though, are supposed to stick around for several years yet, assuming they don't die in the field, so their psychological well being would probably be a bigger concern.
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Three Dog on Tue 15 May 2012 - 4:09

@Tross wrote:

@Alfisti wrote:Potententially another reason to keep the two generations seperated is that, by the time the 2nd Gens are coming online, the Gen1 girls are starting to degenerate as the conditioning kills them, that'd have to be a bit of a moral killer to know it was coming for you, particularly for the more emotionally normalised (aparently) second generation.

That is true. I mean, sure Gen 2s are more emotionally stable, both due to their relatively recent induction into the cyborg program, and less exposure to the unavoidable side effects, as well as to their age. But being constantly reminded that you're going to die within a few years is something that could have a psychological impact. Since all the Gen 1s are all slowly reaching the end, there's very little that could make things any worse for them. Gen 2s though, are supposed to stick around for several years yet, assuming they don't die in the field, so their psychological well being would probably be a bigger concern.
Perhaps it's a matter of the Second Gens wanting to stay away from the Gen Ones. From what I gather, none of the cyborgs know all that much about the conditioing process, so when the Second Gens see the Firsts begin to drop, they might freak out and wonder if it's contagious or some nonsense. Wait... that's basically what you said just with more making fun of the Second Gens. Whoops

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Nachtsider on Tue 15 May 2012 - 5:58

Let's just face it: Yu flubbed where it came to cyborg-cyborg interactions, not paying enough attention to that department. One of GSG's few failings.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Alfisti on Tue 15 May 2012 - 6:11

@Tross wrote:...they have some pretty cool science labs, which would have required some serious building modifications. I guess by comparison, wanting to add in another bathroom isn't such a big deal, so you do have a point there.
Trust me when I say, the minute you put "bio" or "medical" in front of anything, the approvals process gets about ten times harder. Yes, building a bathroom would be a cakewalk by comparison Razz

@Tross wrote:
@Alfisti wrote:I tend to agree with Tross in that the girls probably don't mix much as a result of the age gaps. That said, the 2nd Gen rooms did appear to have a more modern layout.


I noticed that. I'm sure a part of it is that bunk beds are more suited to children, so of course they'll have actual beds. But, that only accounts for a part of the layout. I don't think I have a response for that one, so bravo for stumping me. Puzzled
Hey, I'm 25 and I still love bunkbeds. Razz

In seriousness though, part of it could be recognising that they're older (not to mention emotionally more "normal") and need to be accomodated accordingly, but again, at 14 I know most people I knew still scrambled for the top bunk. Another possibility could be that the SWA is indeed just housing cyborgs where it has the space to do so, in which case they may simply be in a different part of the wing or in a different building with a different layout. I used to work in a refurbished hotel, with a modern add-on out the back... the contrast in rooms was stark to say the least.


@Tross wrote:...sure Gen 2s are more emotionally stable, both due to their relatively recent induction into the cyborg program, and less exposure to the unavoidable side effects, as well as to their age. But being constantly reminded that you're going to die within a few years is something that could have a psychological impact. Since all the Gen 1s are all slowly reaching the end, there's very little that could make things any worse for them. Gen 2s though, are supposed to stick around for several years yet, assuming they don't die in the field, so their psychological well being would probably be a bigger concern.
More emotionally stable yes, but by the same token also not so conditioned on the emotional level to accept that it's their lot in life to die at seven years (ok, I'm verging on speculation here now). They may not be able to shrug that off or banish it from their minds as easially as a girl with the first-generation conditioning may be able to.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Tross on Thu 17 May 2012 - 3:16

I suppose an organization that turns young girls(even severely disabled or near dead ones) into cyborgs who assassinate and capture terrorists, using force that is beyond excessive for typical law enforcement, wouldn't think twice about building regulations and by-laws. I suppose building add-ons and modifications would be far more commonplace than construction of whole new buildings, and contrast between different wings probably wouldn't be as noticeable to someone who lives in Europe and sees that sort of thing a lot. I wonder if construction is a big industry there?

Yeah, I guess being conditioned to not dwell on something like impending death would help keep the gen 1s emotionally stable enough to do their job, and the SWA doesn't have that same luxury with the gen 2s. Of course, the gen 2s still have some conditioning, so all would not be lost if one of them cracked. But it would be more difficult to set her right again. Perhaps it would require more than just conditioning. Dr. Bianchi's services as a psychologist might be more needed, and maybe the SWA will have to employ more staff that specialize in that field. There are quite a few facets of the gen 2s that I wish would be explored more. That's the one downside to only having one gen 2 that has a large role.
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Three Dog on Thu 17 May 2012 - 5:13

@Tross wrote:I suppose an organization that turns young girls(even severely disabled or near dead ones) into cyborgs who assassinate and capture terrorists, using force that is beyond excessive for typical law enforcement, wouldn't think twice about building regulations and by-laws. I suppose building add-ons and modifications would be far more commonplace than construction of whole new buildings, and contrast between different wings probably wouldn't be as noticeable to someone who lives in Europe and sees that sort of thing a lot. I wonder if construction is a big industry there?
Now all I can imagins is the SWA being taken down, not by an army, or toerrorist, or some sort of catastrphe, but by Work Safe or Occupational Health and Safety. The government ttakes out its own agency, oh the irony.

@Tross wrote:Yeah, I guess being conditioned to not dwell on something like impending death would help keep the gen 1s emotionally stable enough to do their job, and the SWA doesn't have that same luxury with the gen 2s. Of course, the gen 2s still have some conditioning, so all would not be lost if one of them cracked. But it would be more difficult to set her right again. Perhaps it would require more than just conditioning. Dr. Bianchi's services as a psychologist might be more needed, and maybe the SWA will have to employ more staff that specialize in that field. There are quite a few facets of the gen 2s that I wish would be explored more. That's the one downside to only having one gen 2 that has a large role.

I too wish to learn about the Second Gens, though my love of them is fading as I discover bit by tiny bit that they aren't badass super soldiers like the First Gens. I'd like to learn more about Soni, she seems cool and sarcastic.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Alfisti on Thu 17 May 2012 - 5:18

@Tross wrote:I wonder if construction is a big industry there?
Dunno, but there was a construction role in Sicily advertised a little bit back which was very tempting...

@Tross wrote:Yeah, I guess being conditioned to not dwell on something like impending death would help keep the gen 1s emotionally stable enough to do their job, and the SWA doesn't have that same luxury with the gen 2s. Of course, the gen 2s still have some conditioning, so all would not be lost if one of them cracked. But it would be more difficult to set her right again. Perhaps it would require more than just conditioning. Dr. Bianchi's services as a psychologist might be more needed, and maybe the SWA will have to employ more staff that specialize in that field. There are quite a few facets of the gen 2s that I wish would be explored more. That's the one downside to only having one gen 2 that has a large role.
I've got to admit, I tend to view the Gen2 conditioning more as an evolution of the Gen1 system rather than a revolution. Keeping in mind that one of the goals of the agency is medical advancement for civilians (and keeping its own overheads down), I think that the Gen2s are given more emotional freedom/mental flexibility as it is concurrent with the goals of the agency, as well as providing a more flexible platform. However, should it be required I imagine it quite possible to dope up Gen2 up like a Gen1 and re-boot her. Maybe not on the same conditioning drug as the Gen1s, but with similar effects.

Speculation of course. As you noted: Yu doesn't go into the conditioning's technical aspects much (which is fine, I don't thing super-technical sci-fi was what he was aiming for), which leaves room for much debate.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Three Dog on Thu 17 May 2012 - 5:23

@Alfisti wrote:[Speculation of course. As you noted: Yu doesn't go into the conditioning's technical aspects much (which is fine, I don't thing super-technical sci-fi was what he was aiming for), which leaves room for much debate.
Maybe we should hunt donw Mr. Aida and make him write some side stories to fill in the gaps. Wait, NO! don't! What I image it would be like and what it would be like will be completely different and ruin it for me.
Looks like we're not going to Japan after all.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Alfisti on Thu 17 May 2012 - 5:36

Destroyer of Worlds ;D wrote:Looks like we're not going to Japan after all.
Well, maybe you're not... I'm thinking Christmas in Tokyo looks very, very appealing.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Three Dog on Thu 17 May 2012 - 5:39

@Alfisti wrote:
Destroyer of Worlds ;D wrote:Looks like we're not going to Japan after all.
Well, maybe you're not... I'm thinking Christmas in Tokyo looks very, very appealing.

Dunno about going to Tokyo for Christmas, but that's just me, I don't particulaly like crowded places. If I went anywhere, I'd either go somewhere in Italy, visit some rellies in Croatia, or go to America ,assuming that out dollar is more than thiers at the time, just 'cause I speak the language. Sorta.

Anyway, you have fun in Tokyo, don't get killed by Godzilla.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Kiskaloo on Thu 17 May 2012 - 9:30

@Alfisti wrote:
Destroyer of Worlds ;D wrote:Looks like we're not going to Japan after all.

Well, maybe you're not... I'm thinking Christmas in Tokyo looks very, very appealing.

I usually go in mid-January as I find the weather tends to be clear and the crowds are gone.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by crazyidiot78 on Thu 17 May 2012 - 12:30

I'm gooing to try to go to japan this time next year
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Tross on Tue 22 May 2012 - 2:14

Isn't Christmas in Tokyo more of a couple's thing? I hear the summers are really hot there, and the crowds would probably be really bad then, so you guys probably have the right idea wanting to go in the winter. I'd love to go to good old Nihon, and see it for myself, but I'll have to save up for it, since I'm not exactly made of money.
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Alfisti on Tue 22 May 2012 - 6:26

@Tross wrote:Isn't Christmas in Tokyo more of a couple's thing?
Search me, I just like cold weather. Also I like how Christmas in Japan seems to basically be pure commercialism with no pretense of it being a Christian holiday. Don't get me wrong: I have no problems with religious Christmas, but I take issue with being told by big corporations that I have to buy lots of stuff in order to celebrate Christ's birthday. I find the total divorce of the two refreshing.

Plus: Engrish Christmas carols and cards. Best. Thing. Ever.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Three Dog on Tue 22 May 2012 - 7:37

@Alfisti wrote:Plus: Engrish Christmas carols and cards. Best. Thing. Ever.
All things in Engrish are funny, not just cards. I still can't get over 'Stuff Parking' and the jar of 'Rock Crap'. Now to look for some of these cards, I'll get my shopping done early.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Nachtsider on Tue 22 May 2012 - 9:12

I have to know what wound up being labelled as 'Rock Crap'.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Schaschanist on Tue 22 May 2012 - 9:57

@Nachtsider wrote:I have to know what wound up being labelled as 'Rock Crap'.
I take he means the traditional "Plum Pudding" or "Christmas Pudding" which usually is known for it's solid consistency.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Three Dog on Tue 22 May 2012 - 18:13

@schaschanist wrote:
@Nachtsider wrote:I have to know what wound up being labelled as 'Rock Crap'.
I take he means the traditional "Plum Pudding" or "Christmas Pudding" which usually is known for it's solid consistency.

Unfortunately, no. It was a jar or Rock Crabs, that had been labelled Rock Crap. So not only is the word wrong, it's not a plural even properly puncuated. Here's Brian Regan to teach how to make something a plural

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Tross on Sat 26 May 2012 - 14:44

Wow, that is hilarious. And bad, even for the Japanese. It's full of epic win! cheers Then again, who doesn't love Engrish? Razz Going to Japan is on my bucket list, so it's going to happen eventually, unless I perish in a freak accident before that could happen. Smile I hope for my sake, the latter doesn't happen.
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Three Dog on Sat 26 May 2012 - 14:56

@Tross wrote:Wow, that is hilarious. And bad, even for the Japanese. It's full of epic win! cheers Then again, who doesn't love Engrish? Razz Going to Japan is on my bucket list, so it's going to happen eventually, unless I perish in a freak accident before that could happen. Smile I hope for my sake, the latter doesn't happen.

What if the freak accident is Japan falling on you? Sorry, it's late here. Nearly four in the morning in fact.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by tremec6speed on Sat 26 May 2012 - 15:50

Destroyer of Worlds ;D wrote:
@schaschanist wrote:
@Nachtsider wrote:I have to know what wound up being labelled as 'Rock Crap'.
I take he means the traditional "Plum Pudding" or "Christmas Pudding" which usually is known for it's solid consistency.

Unfortunately, no. It was a jar or Rock Crabs, that had been labelled Rock Crap. So not only is the word wrong, it's not a plural even properly puncuated. Here's Brian Regan to teach how to make something a plural
he's funny
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Tross on Tue 29 May 2012 - 1:53

Destroyer of Worlds ;D wrote:
@Tross wrote:Wow, that is hilarious. And bad, even for the Japanese. It's full of epic win! cheers Then again, who doesn't love Engrish? Razz Going to Japan is on my bucket list, so it's going to happen eventually, unless I perish in a freak accident before that could happen. Smile I hope for my sake, the latter doesn't happen.

What if the freak accident is Japan falling on you? Sorry, it's late here. Nearly four in the morning in fact.

That would be ironic. But, that would defy all logic, and physics, so I highly doubt that'll happen. I'm going to chalk that up to your late night forum posting. It's a bad habit, but I do it all the time, so I know all about it. But, being killed in a car crash caused by a Japanese driver is possible. Car crashes claim the lives of a lot of people each year, worldwide. It's actually not something to joke about. But, if it were to happen to me, and the driver was Japanese, that would be ironic. Ideally, that wouldn't be my final fate, but the point is, who really knows when they're going to die? That's not the best topic to get into though, so I suppose it's much easier to just assume that a fatal accident won't happen to me, until it does.
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Three Dog on Tue 29 May 2012 - 2:18

@Tross wrote:
Destroyer of Worlds ;D wrote:
@Tross wrote:Wow, that is hilarious. And bad, even for the Japanese. It's full of epic win! cheers Then again, who doesn't love Engrish? Razz Going to Japan is on my bucket list, so it's going to happen eventually, unless I perish in a freak accident before that could happen. Smile I hope for my sake, the latter doesn't happen.

What if the freak accident is Japan falling on you? Sorry, it's late here. Nearly four in the morning in fact.

That would be ironic. But, that would defy all logic, and physics, so I highly doubt that'll happen. I'm going to chalk that up to your late night forum posting. It's a bad habit, but I do it all the time, so I know all about it. But, being killed in a car crash caused by a Japanese driver is possible. Car crashes claim the lives of a lot of people each year, worldwide. It's actually not something to joke about. But, if it were to happen to me, and the driver was Japanese, that would be ironic. Ideally, that wouldn't be my final fate, but the point is, who really knows when they're going to die? That's not the best topic to get into though, so I suppose it's much easier to just assume that a fatal accident won't happen to me, until it does.

Actually, if nothing else gets you, cancer will. I know it seems glum, but the cancer rate in Australia has increased form 1 in 5 peple to 1 in 3 people (I think). But that's becuase we have cures for more and more diseases, and our lives are becoming safer, so nothing else is actually getting to us. And a cancer is just uncrontrolled cell growth which can be difficult to prevent in same cases.

Though, if we want to get really technical, it's lack of oxygen to the brain that kills you. Not the cancer/stab wound/whatever fate hath dealt you.

(Now I'm waiting for our resident biologist to call me down for getting something wrong. I'm pretty sure I didn't but Murphy can strike when you least expect him)

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Re: Petrushka

Post by crazyidiot78 on Tue 29 May 2012 - 7:48

DOW your comments are on the mark. It is true people for the most part are healthier and living longer (the current obesity epidemic aside). This means that people are more likely to get conditions like cancer, and alzhimers, among other things. Another possibility is that the conditions in Australia have changed exposing the population to more carcinogenic materials, (I'm not sure what though as I have to do some research on that end). An example from another country is the higher risk of stomach cancer in japanese due to eating more mercury ladden tuna, or here in the USA with colon cancer due to our diet. Also in the Ukraine due to chernobyl and southern Chile and argentina with skin cancer due to the hole in the ozone layer. Also a large percentage of healthcare dollars being spent happen in the last few years of life as everything breaks down at once (this is a bit of simplification). Although I would add that certain diseases and conditions can kills you without a lack of oxygen to the brain. Traumatic head injuries where your brain is turned into swiss cheese, along with several other conditions that do the same thing.
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Three Dog on Tue 29 May 2012 - 7:55

@crazyidiot78 wrote: DOW your comments are on the mark.
Hell yeah! cheers I knew I had to get something correct this week. I can die happy now.

@crazyidiot78 wrote:Although I would add that certain diseases and conditions can kills you without a lack of oxygen to the brain. Traumatic head injuries where your brain is turned into swiss cheese, along with several other conditions that do the same thing.
And that's where Murphy interveens. I was certain I had mentioned something like, but I guess i'd forgotten . I'll have to pay more attention when I type. But at least I got one part right; your brain dying is the ultimate reason you die.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by ElfenMagix on Tue 29 May 2012 - 14:50

Destroyer of Worlds ;D wrote:Actually, if nothing else gets you, cancer will. I know it seems glum, but the cancer rate in Australia has increased form 1 in 5 peple to 1 in 3 people (I think). But that's becuase we have cures for more and more diseases, and our lives are becoming safer, so nothing else is actually getting to us. And a cancer is just uncrontrolled cell growth which can be difficult to prevent in same cases.

Though, if we want to get really technical, it's lack of oxygen to the brain that kills you. Not the cancer/stab wound/whatever fate hath dealt you.

(Now I'm waiting for our resident biologist to call me down for getting something wrong. I'm pretty sure I didn't but Murphy can strike when you least expect him)
No. Not always true and in most cases its not.
Death's final blow is brain death, but it is not because of lack of O2 that kills it in most occasions. The brain is a tricky think and it can be shut down. In short, give enough pain stimulus and the brain shuts down. Restarting a brain is down right impossible, thus there is no CPR for the Grey and White matter in your head. Besides, the skull gets in the way of doing it too. This is what kills most people in traumatic injuries. One gets shot of stabbed in a vital place, fall from a high place, gets into a car wreck, gets electrocuted, etc; even in ancient times, a sword to the right places causes instant death. This is why it happens - too much pain stimulus and the brain shuts down.

My favorite is Massive Cellular Discorporation, were individual cells are ripped part or otherwise blown up from pressures within or outside exceeding their structural strengths. This happens to everybody everyday on such a small scale that its not given any attention to. But raise the numbers of cells up by 3, 4, 5, 6 factors, then you begin to have death occur. Having an explosive blow up in front you - you will be discorporated into a fine mist of body fluids and bone fragments in a micro second. The brain has no time to react about dying other than having to be shut off in mid thought. It does not die from lack of O2 - hell there was more than enough O2 in the area to support the explosion in the first place! On a small scale, a Basilar Skull Fracture is Cellular Discorporation of the brain in such a scale thats un believable if you think about it. As the bone plates of the skull shift in a Basilar Fracture, it rips the connecting tissues if the skull and Brain, releasing Celecro/Spinal Fluid in the Brain Cavity. This increases pressures inside the brain causing more cells to discorporate and causes immediate death. This is what happened to Dale Enhart and many other race drivers as it is a rare injury that happens mostly in their sport. again, there is plenty of O2 going around at this time and the heart continues to pump O2 rich blood to the brain, but the Brain is too injured to deal with deficit loss on such a scale. it is one of a few body parts that takes years to heal!

Quick Acting Poisons act in several ways. As a neurotoxin, nerve and brain cells are killed by having their electrical components shut down, chemicals ripping apart the cell membrane (Cellular discorporation again), and ending the O2 transfer from the Blood. Some animal venom is just plan deadlier then Cyanide which can kill in under a second. But this is so quick in its actions that there is no time for the brain to react. Its like having your brain's electrical polarity reversed, and it can not withstand that kind of shift and dies immediately.

Cancer is when the host DNA breaks down and creates new genes and thus new cells. But much the original DNA is still intact so the immune defenses leaves it alone. One thing about cancer, many cancer patients complain about the pain associated with the disease that most give up the will to live because of that pain. When you lose the will the live, you can basically shut down your own brain with just a few thoughts, no matter how much modern medicine tries to keep you alive. It is disheartening seeing somebody go through this. I have with a few relatives. Back to point, its only rare that a few people die from the O2 decrease due to cancer. They mostly die from the pain associated with it. Lung Cancer, Cystic Fibrosis and maybe one or two others are medical conditions where you die from the lack of O2 in your blood, but no other cancers kills you in this way. Most cancers kill you by stealing vital resources such as nutrients from the blood and not the O2. This is what makes one weak, and when weakened enough, one dies.

In the recent past, more people died from the cancer treatments than they did from the actual cancer. A friend and an uncle of mine years ago both died from Stomach cancer, but the cause of death was from it directly stealing the food nutrients in the stomach, and those my friend and uncle both ate well, they basically starved to death from an opportunistic tumor stealing the food they ate. My grandmother had Lymphomia (Cancer for the Lymph Nodes) for more than 30 years. She out lived 2 of her own doctors who also had the disease. For some reason, though it made her weak, it did not kill her. She died from an infection she caught at the hospital.

So its not the Lack of Oxygen to the brain that kills you, its maybe 30% of the time that it happens. There are other causes to Death than just that.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by tremec6speed on Tue 29 May 2012 - 14:55

Destroyer of Worlds ;D wrote:
@schaschanist wrote:
@Nachtsider wrote:I have to know what wound up being labelled as 'Rock Crap'.
I take he means the traditional "Plum Pudding" or "Christmas Pudding" which usually is known for it's solid consistency.

Unfortunately, no. It was a jar or Rock Crabs, that had been labelled Rock Crap. So not only is the word wrong, it's not a plural even properly puncuated. Here's Brian Regan to teach how to make something a plural
Do you know who's the cool illustrator of this video? Puzzled
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Re: Petrushka

Post by Thescarredman on Tue 29 May 2012 - 16:32

Elfen, you just had to pop the kid's bubble, didn't you?

Thanks for the wonderfully detailed if somewhat depressing monograph on the root causes of death. I think I may print it out.
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Re: Petrushka

Post by ElfenMagix on Tue 29 May 2012 - 16:49

@Thescarredman wrote:Elfen, you just had to pop the kid's bubble, didn't you?

Thanks for the wonderfully detailed if somewhat depressing monograph on the root causes of death. I think I may print it out.
Why thank you.

Though there are many ways to die, dying from a lack of Oxygen can take days, and a sudden loss of O2 can take 4 - 8 minutes (if not submerged in Ice cold freezing water, then that can take hours...). But Death can be an instantaneous event. A "Lights Out!" event lasting less than a second. I was just trying to correct the facts here and not say that "YOU'RE WRONG! (do a happy dance)".

My fave is Cellular Discorporation because of the amount of energy needed to have it happen. Even in the case of Ebola and other Hemorrhagic Fevers where this happens, it take a lot of work by the infectious material to get the job done!

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Re: Petrushka

Post by crazyidiot78 on Tue 29 May 2012 - 19:50

@ElfenMagix wrote:
Destroyer of Worlds ;D wrote:Actually, if nothing else gets you, cancer will. I know it seems glum, but the cancer rate in Australia has increased form 1 in 5 peple to 1 in 3 people (I think). But that's becuase we have cures for more and more diseases, and our lives are becoming safer, so nothing else is actually getting to us. And a cancer is just uncrontrolled cell growth which can be difficult to prevent in same cases.

Though, if we want to get really technical, it's lack of oxygen to the brain that kills you. Not the cancer/stab wound/whatever fate hath dealt you.

(Now I'm waiting for our resident biologist to call me down for getting something wrong. I'm pretty sure I didn't but Murphy can strike when you least expect him)
No. Not always true and in most cases its not.
Death's final blow is brain death, but it is not because of lack of O2 that kills it in most occasions. The brain is a tricky think and it can be shut down. In short, give enough pain stimulus and the brain shuts down. Restarting a brain is down right impossible, thus there is no CPR for the Grey and White matter in your head. Besides, the skull gets in the way of doing it too. This is what kills most people in traumatic injuries. One gets shot of stabbed in a vital place, fall from a high place, gets into a car wreck, gets electrocuted, etc; even in ancient times, a sword to the right places causes instant death. This is why it happens - too much pain stimulus and the brain shuts down.

My favorite is Massive Cellular Discorporation, were individual cells are ripped part or otherwise blown up from pressures within or outside exceeding their structural strengths. This happens to everybody everyday on such a small scale that its not given any attention to. But raise the numbers of cells up by 3, 4, 5, 6 factors, then you begin to have death occur. Having an explosive blow up in front you - you will be discorporated into a fine mist of body fluids and bone fragments in a micro second. The brain has no time to react about dying other than having to be shut off in mid thought. It does not die from lack of O2 - hell there was more than enough O2 in the area to support the explosion in the first place! On a small scale, a Basilar Skull Fracture is Cellular Discorporation of the brain in such a scale thats un believable if you think about it. As the bone plates of the skull shift in a Basilar Fracture, it rips the connecting tissues if the skull and Brain, releasing Celecro/Spinal Fluid in the Brain Cavity. This increases pressures inside the brain causing more cells to discorporate and causes immediate death. This is what happened to Dale Enhart and many other race drivers as it is a rare injury that happens mostly in their sport. again, there is plenty of O2 going around at this time and the heart continues to pump O2 rich blood to the brain, but the Brain is too injured to deal with deficit loss on such a scale. it is one of a few body parts that takes years to heal!

Quick Acting Poisons act in several ways. As a neurotoxin, nerve and brain cells are killed by having their electrical components shut down, chemicals ripping apart the cell membrane (Cellular discorporation again), and ending the O2 transfer from the Blood. Some animal venom is just plan deadlier then Cyanide which can kill in under a second. But this is so quick in its actions that there is no time for the brain to react. Its like having your brain's electrical polarity reversed, and it can not withstand that kind of shift and dies immediately.

Cancer is when the host DNA breaks down and creates new genes and thus new cells. But much the original DNA is still intact so the immune defenses leaves it alone. One thing about cancer, many cancer patients complain about the pain associated with the disease that most give up the will to live because of that pain. When you lose the will the live, you can basically shut down your own brain with just a few thoughts, no matter how much modern medicine tries to keep you alive. It is disheartening seeing somebody go through this. I have with a few relatives. Back to point, its only rare that a few people die from the O2 decrease due to cancer. They mostly die from the pain associated with it. Lung Cancer, Cystic Fibrosis and maybe one or two others are medical conditions where you die from the lack of O2 in your blood, but no other cancers kills you in this way. Most cancers kill you by stealing vital resources such as nutrients from the blood and not the O2. This is what makes one weak, and when weakened enough, one dies.

In the recent past, more people died from the cancer treatments than they did from the actual cancer. A friend and an uncle of mine years ago both died from Stomach cancer, but the cause of death was from it directly stealing the food nutrients in the stomach, and those my friend and uncle both ate well, they basically starved to death from an opportunistic tumor stealing the food they ate. My grandmother had Lymphomia (Cancer for the Lymph Nodes) for more than 30 years. She out lived 2 of her own doctors who also had the disease. For some reason, though it made her weak, it did not kill her. She died from an infection she caught at the hospital.

So its not the Lack of Oxygen to the brain that kills you, its maybe 30% of the time that it happens. There are other causes to Death than just that.

Sorry bout that DOW, and Eflen, I had a bit to much fun (root liquer and cream soda/ Root liquer root beer and ice cream/ root liquer martini) at the time and forgot the loss of cellular cohesion. The following video will show the anime equivelant.

[youtube][/youtube][
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crazyidiot78

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Forum Posts : 1534

Location : Mongolia.... that is all

Fan of : Claes

Original Characters : none at this time

Comments : Me- So I used Naruto as a way to explain how viruses destroy cells in class ...... ok that as odd...... but it actually worked.

Me- I feel like a secret agent man, as my wallet now has six different currencies in it

Me- It has come to my attention that it is impossible to buy liver in Mongolia because it is bad, but it is perfectly ok to buy salt sheep heads

Registration date : 2010-01-10

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Three Dog on Wed 30 May 2012 - 2:09

@ElfenMagix wrote:
@Thescarredman wrote:Elfen, you just had to pop the kid's bubble, didn't you?

Thanks for the wonderfully detailed if somewhat depressing monograph on the root causes of death. I think I may print it out.
Why thank you.

Though there are many ways to die, dying from a lack of Oxygen can take days, and a sudden loss of O2 can take 4 - 8 minutes (if not submerged in Ice cold freezing water, then that can take hours...). But Death can be an instantaneous event. A "Lights Out!" event lasting less than a second. I was just trying to correct the facts here and not say that "YOU'RE WRONG! (do a happy dance)".

My fave is Cellular Discorporation because of the amount of energy needed to have it happen. Even in the case of Ebola and other Hemorrhagic Fevers where this happens, it take a lot of work by the infectious material to get the job done!
Nah, I don't mind. Honestly, I was waiting for something like this to happen. It always does.

@crazyidiot78 wrote:

Sorry bout that DOW, and Eflen, I had a
bit to much fun (root liquer and cream soda/ Root liquer root beer and
ice cream/ root liquer martini) at the time and forgot the loss of
cellular cohesion. The following video will show the anime equivelant.

[youtube][/youtube]
Nothing to appologise for. Though, I kinda wonder why the people all became bright orange. Doesn't seem right.

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Re: Petrushka

Post by Tross on Thu 31 May 2012 - 1:13

I think we need to come up with a new word for going off topic from our off topic topic.
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Re: Petrushka

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